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gb
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« Reply #30 on: March 16, 2010, 11:44:07 PM »

hey, happierrunner, it' ain't worth it.  

We certainly all started out trying to help with a pair of apparently ill-fitting VFF, but it seems now he's just set on thinking our views are biased and not worth listening to, as long as it's pro-VFF...  So, not a lot of point continuing.  Anyone can choose to hate VFFs and love Evo, for whatever rational or irrational reasons.   And, Evo is fine; we have nothing against Evo here.   And for that matter, nothing against any anti-VFF crusade either.  I am also fine being one of the fanboys, even though I am a girl.  Smiley   Simply put:  whatever.  Let's just all move on.  

This forum has always been offering pleasant and helpful exchanges.  We are clearly no longer offering any helpful views to him, so let's just call it a day.    

And Delta6, definitely good luck with your VFF refund; we hope your experience with Evo will be a better one!!
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« Reply #30 on: March 16, 2010, 11:44:07 PM »

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Delta6
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« Reply #31 on: March 16, 2010, 11:49:42 PM »



And Delta6, definitely good luck with your VFF refund; we hope your experience with Evo will be a better one!!

Thank you honestly. And believe or not I did appreciate the help, I just didn't appreciate being grilled about what decision I reached.

Happy running everyone...  Smiley

I am also fine being one of the fanboys, even though I am a girl.  Smiley   

Now it makes sense why you have 6 pairs of shoes from one company  Tongue
« Last Edit: March 16, 2010, 11:55:55 PM by Delta6 » Logged
hippierunner
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« Reply #32 on: March 17, 2010, 12:07:29 AM »

That's not ignorant.  If I was ignorant I would have purchased them already without questioning the quality.  Maybe arrogant doesn't mean what you think it does either, look it up.  A bit hypocritical of me, liking a product with a known quality control issue, but I do already have a pair and have been 100% satisfied.  I'm making an informed decision to wait on my purchase due to the recent quality control issues.  You've already purchased the VFF and we have been trying to help you on it's shortcomings.

I do understand fanboyism.  I don't recommend VFF to everyone, I'm aware of their quality control issues, and I'm not affraid to tell people about them.  I work in IT as a senior engineer, I hear people spewing BS all the time about this company or that, and I never understood how people can really pick 1 company on any product line, shoes or technology.  Companies have good times and bad, all of them.  I don't consider the Nike Free minimalist.  Puma's racing flats are more minimal than the Nike Free.

I still don't know what you mean..."Says the kid who...."

EDIT:  Anyway I'm done in this thread.  Good luck with the Evo's, I'm curious about them myself.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 12:14:14 AM by hippierunner » Logged
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« Reply #33 on: March 17, 2010, 12:22:13 AM »

That's not ignorant.  If I was ignorant I would have purchased them already without questioning the quality.  Maybe arrogant doesn't mean what you think it does either, look it up.  A bit hypocritical of me, liking a product with a known quality control issue, but I do already have a pair and have been 100% satisfied.  I'm making an informed decision to wait on my purchase due to the recent quality control issues.  You've already purchased the VFF and we have been trying to help you on it's shortcomings.

I do understand fanboyism.  I don't recommend VFF to everyone, I'm aware of their quality control issues, and I'm not affraid to tell people about them.  I work in IT as a senior engineer, I hear people spewing BS all the time about this company or that, and I never understood how people can really pick 1 company on any product line, shoes or technology.  Companies have good times and bad, all of them.  I don't consider the Nike Free minimalist.  Puma's racing flats are more minimal than the Nike Free.

I still don't know what you mean..."Says the kid who...."

EDIT:  Anyway I'm done in this thread.  Good luck with the Evo's, I'm curious about them myself.


Howd I know the vibram owner wouldnt consider the Frees minimalist haha. For their time they were. Man people in IT love their "titles" haha. Dont take the fanboy comments so seriously. Good luck with your Very Funky Feet... Thats what the VFF stands for right.... :p I keed
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 12:25:01 AM by Delta6 » Logged
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« Reply #33 on: March 17, 2010, 12:22:13 AM »

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gb
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« Reply #34 on: March 17, 2010, 12:23:53 AM »

I am also fine being one of the fanboys, even though I am a girl.  Smiley   

Now it makes sense why you have 6 pairs of shoes from one company  Tongue
[/quote]

yup, indeed it's something the XY chromies don't get easily.  But, my set does serve different functionality: surge for watersports/winter, classics for casual wear, KSO for active stuff, sprints for active stuff in warmer weather, and of course, a couple extra pair just for their nice colors.   Smiley    Plus they do stink after continual wear so rotation is needed.  

I am happy to call myself a VFF evangelist.  I think they are one of the best things that I've encountered in the past couple years (and I have a pretty cool/nice life overall.)   I'd love to share them with others, though certainly understand others may not be as impressed (my boyfriend, for one, wears them only once in awhile; I think more to please me than out of any real love for the shoes... )

and by the way, I did branch out to a pair of Feelmax.  They just didn't do it for me.  they felt like glorified slippers to me...
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« Reply #35 on: March 17, 2010, 12:32:12 AM »


surge for watersports/winter, classics for casual wear, KSO for active stuff, sprints for active stuff in warmer weather, and of course, a couple extra pair just for their nice colors.   Smiley

You are certifiable...but in a good way hahaha Atleast your doing cool stuff with all of those pairs.

I was looking at the Feelmax but a lot of ppl said the soles wear out quickly.
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Rana
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« Reply #36 on: March 17, 2010, 02:01:37 AM »

I really don't understand the point of the original post.

Who comes into a community of people who share a love of something, and complains about that thing in their very first post, and dismisses everyone as being too invested in the thing to be worth listening to?  I mean, really.

I also don't understand how, after it was clear (and you admitted as much yourself) that your own feet might not be well-suited to VFFs, that you continue to blame the product for not anticipating every possible foot shape under the sun. 

Then you say you're going to steer away your fiance (who, presumably has different feet than you, and ought to be allowed to make her own decisions about her own feet) from VFFs just because something that works for a lot of other people didn't work for you. 

That's a little weird, man.  The shoes aren't for you, we get that. 

But why assume that this lack of fit for one guy with funky toes means that the shoes are inherently flawed and anyone who likes them is a nut?

And, even if so, why would you go onto a forum filled with people like that, and tell them this?  *shakes head*

Good luck with your other shoes.  I hope they don't disappoint you.  You sound like a hard guy to please.
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Delta6
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« Reply #37 on: March 17, 2010, 07:27:38 AM »

I really don't understand the point of the original post.
Who comes into a community of people who share a love of something, and complains about that thing in their very first post,


Your right I should have gone to a Linux forum with my Vibram issue. And it is the most bizarre thing ever to post an issue in a relevant community about a possible issue future owners could have with the product. Pretty much ludicrous.. 

I also don't understand how, after it was clear (and you admitted as much yourself) that your own feet might not be well-suited to VFFs, that you continue to blame the product for not anticipating every possible foot shape under the sun. 

Then you say you're going to steer away your fiance (who, presumably has different feet than you, and ought to be allowed to make her own decisions about her own feet) from VFFs just because something that works for a lot of other people didn't work for you. 



Why buy a product from a company that has a known quality control/defect problem?



And its more than just the design and more than just me ...

http://birthdayshoes.com/forum/birthdayshoes-com-general-discussion/vff-defects!/


We all spread half-truths...its ok its kinda like getting partial credit on an essay question.

And, even if so, why would you go onto a forum filled with people like that, and tell them this?  *shakes head*

Good luck with your other shoes.  I hope they don't disappoint you.  You sound like a hard guy to please.


It's actually just getting hilarious how tweaked people are getting over this.
You sound like a thin skinned girl.
It would just be insane to tell the next person, I’ve heard some people love them however the company is producing some questionable products at this time and I had an issue with fit which could potentially be a problem for the next buyer and I would look elsewhere for a minimalist shoe. I think it’s inconsiderate to steer someone towards a product like that IMO.
But just so I'm clear...If someone were to have a positive experience with a product and gave them a positive recommendation they would be praised. However, if someone has a negative experience with a product and becomes aware that the company making the products is going through a quality control problem and chose to provide a negative recommendation…then they should get nailed to the cross…gotcha.
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jadias
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« Reply #38 on: March 17, 2010, 08:30:09 AM »

And this is why I love the internet.

Just counting down the days until someone mentions Hitler or Obama... Roll Eyes
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« Reply #39 on: March 17, 2010, 09:45:17 AM »

I should really read the entire thread  Tongue

I didn't realize it made it to the third page that quickly.

It is unfortunate this thread started so late in the evening.  I would have made a good thread during my normal working hours Tongue
« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 10:52:21 AM by balsam0 » Logged
justin
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« Reply #40 on: March 17, 2010, 09:57:13 AM »

Delta6 has been banned.  Here's why:

- Antagonistic behavior evidenced by innuendo, sarcastic remarks, and a general "tone" that makes it clear he's no longer interested in having a productive discussion

Delta6 was explicitly *not* banned for criticizing VFFs or pointing out what he sees as defects -- something that has been done countless times before on this forum and led to a good bit of productive discussion. 


That said, I think Rana made some great points and I echo her comments.

Personally, what I think Delta6's doesn't realize is that if you were to design in a rubber wall on the inside of each toe, you'd have to decide where to put it -- do you make it big enough to accomodate outlier toes -- very fat or very narrow?  In the case of Delta6's big toe, which is not only "wide" (a good bit wider than my big toe, by comparison) and inward pointing, any inner wall would necessarily push on his second toe (I see no space between his big toe and second toe in his photo).  So were there a custom design just for Delta6's feet with the inner wall he suggests, I'm skeptical it would actually be suitable for him. 

What might work in the case of his "wide big toe" is a wider big toe rubber base with the same flexi-fabric on the sides of the toe slots.  This would provide a big enough base while not adding additional side bulk to the side of the toe.

All this brings me to the big takeaway here, which I don't gather Delta6 figured out, and that is that Vibram Five Fingers are built to fit feet falling within (I'm guessing) two standard deviations of the mean foot.  What I *mean* by this is that if you have really fat toes, substantial morton's toe, a huge instep, or any other foot characteristic that is particularly uncommon, there's a decent chance Vibrams won't work for you.  Framed in this light, it's actually somewhat amazing (to me) that VFFs were designed in such a way that they still work for so many people.  They accomplish this by not being too rigid in their structure -- and that's one of the defining characteristics that makes Vibrams great -- if they had more rigidity, I think it would drastically detract from the barefoot feel.  Case in point: the Flow.

Anyway, that VFFs won't work for everyone is an unfortunate given.  They didn't work for Delta6 -- and that's a bummer for him.  That said, and I think this is where Delta6 went off the reservation, he jumped from "they don't work for me" to they are a flawed product that he'd not recommend to anyone.  And therein lies the arrogant behavior -- hubris is what I'd call it (presumptions about product design leading to a hasty generalization).

I thank all of you for being cool -- for the most part, I think how you reacted to Delta6 was exceedingly tolerant.  That said, his behavior isn't welcome here (though I enjoyed seeing his toes!) and he has been removed from the community.
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« Reply #41 on: March 17, 2010, 09:57:59 AM »

Ha, that was my 1000 post.  Glad I made it a doozy   Cheesy Roll Eyes.
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« Reply #42 on: March 17, 2010, 11:54:15 AM »

good move!

i'm on too many LARGE message boards where they let stuff like that go on... it doesn't make for a good community.
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« Reply #43 on: March 17, 2010, 01:04:05 PM »

Kudos, Justin!  Grin
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« Reply #44 on: March 17, 2010, 01:10:42 PM »

Can we also say that he was banned for misspelling YOU'RE so many times? That was a killer...
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